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Earth map

Earth map

Poll ended at Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:53 pm

Favorable
6
55%
Contrary
5
45%
 
Total votes : 11

Earth map

Postby XYZ » Thu May 02, 2013 1:53 pm

Playing on an earth map
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Re: Earth map

Postby Davide » Thu May 02, 2013 2:33 pm

In case we go for a pre-generated map already known to users, we could choose to set the map to be virtually already explored by every player, still preserving the regular fog of war. That way we'll avoid the user's pain to keep 2 freeciv clients opened at once: one for the game, and the other for /observing the map.
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Re: Earth map

Postby XYZ » Thu May 02, 2013 6:31 pm

Earth (classic/small) would be the choice. The other maps are too big.
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Re: Earth map

Postby monamipierrot » Fri May 03, 2013 2:08 pm

I know there's someone out there who loves to play scenarios or known maps.
May I remind everybody that incoming LT32 game is going to be played on a KNOWN map. So, it would be a terrible timing for GT to set a KNOWN (or scenario) map.
I don't want to force anyone, I just want to remind that I resigned from LT32, and my participation to GT05 will be canceled in case we choose a KNOWN (or, even worse, Earthly) map, cause "eXplore" is - for me - some 90% of freeciv fun.
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Re: Earth map

Postby Major Nimrod » Thu May 16, 2013 4:17 pm

I kinda love Earth scenario maps! 8-)

There's something neat about attempting to recreate historical empires. For instance, I'm sure everyone here has - at some point or another - played the Romans on an Earth map and tried to recreate the "Roman Sea" by taking out the historical greeks, celts, etc... and controlling the entire Mediterranean.

I dunno, it helps me get even more involved and immersed into the game. Yes, exploring completely unknown maps is ok but it's nice to send your Caravels out trying to find a continent you just *know* is there, because you're reasonably sure of where you are on the map - only to be pleasantly surprised that you were wrong and are in a completely different part of the world lol ! :lol:

Anyhow, my two cents.
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"What a Nimrod" - Bugs Bunny

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Re: Earth map

Postby Guest » Sat May 25, 2013 1:23 pm

What I don't like about the GT04 is this equal and globalized world that reminds of a prefabricated concret slab. Everybdoy has almost the same piece of land, everybody has more or less the same technological level and everybody has contact with everybody from the very beginning. A world map would create different spheres with different technologic emphasis. Asians would focus more on land units, meanwhile Oceanics would focus on seafaring and Europeans would try to combine both. Oceans stop the unlimited tech proliferation on the beginning, meanwhile little seas can be crossed with a tireme already on an early stage. So from my point of view there is much more exploring and more thrill behind a world map where everybody has to make an effort to discover someone else and where he is rewarded for doing it.
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Re: Earth map

Postby XYZ » Sat May 25, 2013 2:57 pm

Last post was from me.
We could alternatevely leave America empty and encourage by that a colonization race, reenacting Europe at the end of the 15. century. Tiremes could be given the possibility to vessel on deap ocean but with 50% chance to sink like in the ancient freeciv or just leave the long wiking route over Greenland to Vinland! But I'm already happy if we get this world map going, just think of the naval warfares on the big Atlantic Ocean like in WW1 and 2 and so...
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Re: Earth map

Postby monamipierrot » Sat May 25, 2013 8:18 pm

Guest wrote:What I don't like about the GT04 is this equal and globalized world that reminds of a prefabricated concret slab.


It is pretty funny that we share almost the same tastes and still have opposite opinion on Earth maps.
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Re: Earth map

Postby monamipierrot » Sat May 25, 2013 8:19 pm

What do we mean with "Earth"?
I don't know GT04 (And can't find info about it). However, by your comments about it, I understand that GT04 is a "balanced" superlandmass game or maybe a island-balanced-type game (such as GT00).
If I'm not wrong, then I think you're mixing-up two very different issues:
1- whether the map is unknown or known (Scenario/Earth maps fall in the latter category)
2- the kind of map used (roughly distinguishing: "balanced" islands games [GT00, LT31]; "balanced" (super)landmass games [LT29 and all of the small games listed in the Replay Videos]; continents game [LT30, GT01, GT02, as well as Earth])
About (2), I share ALL your tastes: I HATE prefabricated (="balanced") games in which everybody has the "same" little piece of land (one standard-size-and-shape island in a island game, or a even N x N tiles square in a superlandmass game without oceans).
Believe me, I LOVE games with earth-like conditions (lot of variety)
I could even say that Earth is almost the best map I ever saw.
And let me say I think that recreating the History of Earth is THE aim of a GT/LT match.
However, as everybody I'm a great lover of History, and if you love history you should know that a satisfactory Earth map was not completed till the 18th or even 19th century.
The true is that Alexander, or Columbus, or Hannibal, or Cortez didn't have a Earth map.
In short words, the perfect GT game, for me, should be AS IF IT WAS EARTH: variable, unpredictable, wonderful. And of course, completely NEW, as Earth was for Alexander, Columbus & Co.
These conditions can be roughly achieved with "all players in same continent" (the only known way to have big varied continents), along with a small landmass (around 30, as Earth) and "pseudofractal" settings.
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Re: Earth map

Postby monamipierrot » Sat May 25, 2013 8:20 pm

Issues of a continents game
The only issues are:
1. you can't have people distributed in more than one continent (am I wrong?)
2. fiddling with non-all-temperate settings can lead to VERY imbalanced start positions, expecially for BIG games where you can find yourself in a hills&grassland paradise or, at the opposite, in the middle of a jungle/swamp/desert hell (however GT01 would prove the opposite as I started in a incredibly horrible position, and now I'm the leading guy)

More about planetology
Some times ago I wrote the results of my planet experiments http://forum.longturn.org/viewtopic.php?id=19.
You can find some related topics by me also here: http://civland.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=410 and http://civland.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=31&t=411

Wanted features
I only have to add a thing about custom planet generator
I would love if some code expert (Davide?) could find the way to fine control the planet generator and player placement engine, in different ways:
1. generate different size continents (as in Earth) and populate them in a randomly way, only making sure that everybody has a decent amount of land around him, and that there's enough (say around 50%) unsettled/undiscovered land. Something like Civ1 generator would be good.
2. In general, place the players in a way that meets some minimal balance criterias.
3. Achieve a more earth-like climatic rendering, without those predictable, unfair and unesthetical) stripes of desert/jungle/temperate/tundra which occurs when you disable alltemperate. Earth map has ALSO some climatic stripes but it is much more impredictibly varied. This would be the goal.
4. Allow more random and unpredictiblicy by mixing/randomizing continental with island features, e.g. you may find yourself alone or with just another guy in a island without being sure if yours is a normal sized island or if there are also big inhabitated continents (or viceversa).
5. Allow "random" in some setting values (e.g. landmass) such that one can't know which is the actual value chosen by the generator.
6. Allow finetuning of island games in a way that you can INDPENDENTLY set the size of the islands, their distance and the number of players in them.

About (6), I think Akfaew masters it. Plus, there have been a discussion in LT forum about LT31, which was PURPUSELY thought as a network of balanced island in which most where connected by plain shallow Ocean tiles while few other were not (thus not reachable by triremes). This created a intricated maze of island connections, let's call them "archipelagos" virtually isolated between them and containing a microenvironemt of few players (2 to 10). The only bad thing about LT31 (other than it was by far too big) is that with Navigation all of this "superimposed" maze-like map went down and the world became a plain standard-island patchwork too early.
In my opinion, island games can become interesting if we master (6) AND if we delay a lot (e.g. till the Industrial era) the ability to sail Deep Oceans, in order to delay this 2nd game phase.
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